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[momitsnowme]

And then Paul replying that it has been "known for years" when people were posting about that Tumblr on Facebook

[momitsnowme]

I've been doing some talking and digging, just to update. I don't want to say much about it but I feel much better about the allegations against Ryan.

If anyone needs it, check out Eric Ayotte's Facebook post. It was exactly what I needed to hear.

[lindsey]

I texted my best male friend that was involved with me in the DIY scene in NC and hosted ghost mice and other pix shows with me back in the day, and he said "Ah. Well, you travel and tour and don't drink but everyone around you does... It leaves a lot of space open and sexual assault is never something I remember his lyrics covering" I just.... what the fucking hell is wrong with men

[skateandannoy]

I don't really have much to add. I've seen AJJ's comments as well as some others on the matter. I've seen on tumblr some stuff criticizing AJJ going back a few years too though. Punk has always had it's problematic aspects but PIX always felt like such a rejection of all the stuff that sucks about punk. I'm so angry and I'm sorry for all the victims. I too hope they find some peace.

[rory]

Reading more of the accounts and seeing such a blatant pattern, I feel kind of fucked up about my previous statements, but I'm going to leave them here. It's part of processing. Since I'm processing some (minor comparatively but thematically similar) things about my former bandmate and am taking him through accountability, I think when I wrote that I was in a position to think really intensely about restorative justice.

It's fucked that I think that I'm glad that I caught my bandmate in the throws of his lies and shitty behavior when I did, so that he didn't get worse and affect more people further away. I'm fucked up about having to wrangle supposed good men and keep them in line.

There's a lot to think about, but my heart is just aching for all these goddamn women that no one listened to for years.

[GrownFolk]

Am I the only one that still wants to hear the new Ghost Mice album?  I pre-ordered before any of this came out and I'm hoping he makes good on the orders that were placed.

[momitsnowme]

I really liked one of the preview songs. But I canceled my order and got a refund from band camp.

[momitsnowme]

Even if it does come out I won't really be able to enjoy listening to it.

[BlakeK]

I saw an article that had Hannah's response and while I know this must be hard for her, I found it pretty shitty. I don't know if she's revised her stance and should probably research it.

[momitsnowme]

I wasn't thrilled with it, even though I think she has good intentions. However that asshole that keeps talking about her kid pisses me the hell off

[jer]

That idiot attacking her kid also used it as an excuse to promote his shit band, which I'm sure the victims really appreciate.

[momitsnowme]

I saw that. So gross

[BlakeK]

I wasn't thrilled with it, even though I think she has good intentions. However that asshole that keeps talking about her kid pisses me the hell off

I haven't seen it but that's fucked up if someone is talking about her child

[skateandannoy]

Saw Kimya Dawson's response where she also basically said she was unsurprised and mentioned not being happy with Chris' business practices and hasn't been affiliated with the label for years.

[pronetoaccidents]

As far as sad and shitty news one of the guys from dear landlord is up on murder charges after selling dope to someone who overdosed. Supposedly he's the "Chris clavin of heroin" according to people on facebook. Whatever the fuck that means. Pretty sad for him and the victims family

[BlakeK]

As far as sad and shitty news one of the guys from dear landlord is up on murder charges after selling dope to someone who overdosed. Supposedly he's the "Chris clavin of heroin" according to people on facebook. Whatever the fuck that means. Pretty sad for him and the victims family

Yeah I don't know what's that means either but that sucks. I read the google document where people have shared their stories and my first thought was that Chris is the Bill Cosby of folk punk.

I wish Kimya Dawson would have said something earlier. I understand that a lot of people are/were scared because of Chris's social status but Dawson became much more well known than Chris as time went on. I know hindsight is 20/20 and all and I'm not wanting to sound critical of her this all just sucks so much. I really wish there would have been an intervention earlier so he could've gotten help earlier but at least he's doing that now (hopefully) and the victims can start working through it now too. I would think having Chris coming to their towns now and then would be a huge trigger previously and it would suck to know that your abuser is still out seemingly unchecked.

[manmagic]

As far as sad and shitty news one of the guys from dear landlord is up on murder charges after selling dope to someone who overdosed. Supposedly he's the "Chris clavin of heroin" according to people on facebook. Whatever the fuck that means. Pretty sad for him and the victims family

Yeah I don't know what's that means either but that sucks. I read the google document where people have shared their stories and my first thought was that Chris is the Bill Cosby of folk punk.

I wish Kimya Dawson would have said something earlier. I understand that a lot of people are/were scared because of Chris's social status but Dawson became much more well known than Chris as time went on. I know hindsight is 20/20 and all and I'm not wanting to sound critical of her this all just sucks so much. I really wish there would have been an intervention earlier so he could've gotten help earlier but at least he's doing that now (hopefully) and the victims can start working through it now too. I would think having Chris coming to their towns now and then would be a huge trigger previously and it would suck to know that your abuser is still out seemingly unchecked.

I'm still confused, didn't Paul say something earlier and got ostracized from the community because of it? Not that that happening to Paul means Kimya shouldn't have also said something, but I spent a few years now thinking Paul was an awful person for some vague unknown reason and now I feel pretty awful knowing that a large part of that may have been me just taking faith in the wrong people and believing them when they said he fucked up.

Basically a week or so later and I still feel horrible about this. I was just starting to come to terms with the PWR BTTM situation and now I get to hate more of my hero's.

PS: Not trying to make this all about me, just trying to make sense of it all.

[ramblinrabble]

From my experiences and what I've gathered, it's both.  Paul is kind of an awful person, but he also called this stuff out ahead of time.  His being awful is unrelated.

[jer]

I remember Paul having a falling out but I didn't remember him saying this stuff specifically, at least not online or whatever. If he was calling it out I imagine it was more likely in Bloomington, in person, specifically before left, and good on him if this is true.

But from what I gather there was more to that falling out. But it's all speculation on my part, and my memory is poor.

[rory]

From what I remember about Paul stuff, I thought it was someone else (someone who also used to post on this board) who had moved to Bloomington and had quote unquote bad consent with a partner. People in Bloomington didn't handle it head on and Paul tried to and it got messy. That person eventually moved from Bloomington and so did Paul. This person in question had nowhere near the social capital of Chris but was friends with that whole scene obviously.

But I could have just ended up getting some sort of weird side story that is unrelated? No idea. This was many years ago.

[amanda]

Didn't Paul also try to accuse Eric Ayotte of abusing his partner and that wound up being a totally unfounded accusation?

[DanOSullivan]

Super bummed out about all this.

I used to regular the forums years ago before the time when all the data got wiped or whatever.

Chris, Plan-it-X and the whole scene had a massive influence on me as a kid. I learned a lot from the scene, about the value of community, DIY and respect for others (and animals). Now in my late 20s I would hardly call myself punk any more but I still believe in all that stuff very strongly and follow a lot of these bands.

To find out that individuals in the scene were engaged in this kind of stuff is extremely disheartening. I never lived anywhere near Bloomington so I didn't know any of the gossip or all that stuff. I just saved up money for the CDs and went to shows whenever Ghost Mice came to the UK. Even reading this thread and finding out about all the infighting with Paul, Eric, Kimya, Spoonboy and Chris is in itself a major bummer.

I guess you end up putting your heroes on some kind of pedestal when it turns out they are just as shitty (or in this case shitter) than everyone else.

Hope the victim can find a way through all this to something better! I hope Chris can find a way out of all this and find a new path.

(what is next? Propagandhi funnelling money to an abattoir?  :()

[pascaloo]

Yeah Amanda, that's what I've heard too.
The Paul drama and what's happening with Chris shouldn't be related.

Sorry, I don't really want to say more on the internet. I don't know much more than you and I don't really want to share my thoughts about all this publicly. All that stuff is making me feel paranoid, not that I've done anything wrong, but internet and facebook (I'm still not on Facebook and probably never will) really scares me. The guy pushing on Hannah really made me sick ;  I don't want to get involved in this same kind of shit.

Peace

[ismybadluckrunningout]

Didn't Paul also try to accuse Eric Ayotte of abusing his partner and that wound up being a totally unfounded accusation?

This was my understanding, yes.

[jer]

unfounded accusation?

Yeah, I do actually remember this. From what I remember, it was "unfounded" because the partner was denying it was happening apparently, but paul was saying it was happening? something like that. I don't know man.